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	<title>Comments on: Climate Change, Snow, and Africa</title>
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	<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/</link>
	<description>Catholic perspectives on culture, society, and politics</description>
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		<title>By: brettsalkeld</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-73802</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[brettsalkeld]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Mar 2010 02:43:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-73802</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;strong&gt;&quot;This is utterly ridiculous and one of the reasons why I feel the Church is being taken over by a bunch of socialist morons. Name calling other people because they do not agree with you is not very Christian in my book.&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;

What!?!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>&#8220;This is utterly ridiculous and one of the reasons why I feel the Church is being taken over by a bunch of socialist morons. Name calling other people because they do not agree with you is not very Christian in my book.&#8221;</strong></p>
<p>What!?!</p>
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		<title>By: Ellie</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-73799</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ellie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Mar 2010 02:33:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-73799</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I don&#039;t understand what this political dribble has anything to do with the Catholic voice??? Really, is being Catholic about going off with trendy scientists and thought? This is utterly ridiculous and one of the reasons why I feel the Church is being taken over by a bunch of socialist morons. Name calling other people because they do not agree with you is not very Christian in my book.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t understand what this political dribble has anything to do with the Catholic voice??? Really, is being Catholic about going off with trendy scientists and thought? This is utterly ridiculous and one of the reasons why I feel the Church is being taken over by a bunch of socialist morons. Name calling other people because they do not agree with you is not very Christian in my book.</p>
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		<title>By: Moral Kabuki: Torture, EWTN and the Devil : Aprehendite disciplinam</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-73257</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Moral Kabuki: Torture, EWTN and the Devil : Aprehendite disciplinam]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Mar 2010 18:04:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-73257</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] of enhanced interrogation techniques, but indeed the angry young popsicles have been having meltdown over EWTNs apparent torture advocacy. While I agree that watching EWTN programming can be a [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] of enhanced interrogation techniques, but indeed the angry young popsicles have been having meltdown over EWTNs apparent torture advocacy. While I agree that watching EWTN programming can be a [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-72523</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Feb 2010 16:24:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-72523</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;The truth is we don’t understand a lot about what is going on with our climate or what is causing it.There are some unusual patterns developing but if...&quot;

Perhaps on a scale of 20 to 30 years,there seems to be unusual patterns, though when viewed on a longer timeframe these patterns are not so unusual.

With that said, we have opportunities to improve efficiencies and reduce our consumption, and in ways that can benefit our poorer and oppressed neighbors around the world. Imagine the health of our economy and growth if the desperate poor in Africa and Asia could benefit and enjoy some of the comfort and stability we take for granted in the West.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The truth is we don’t understand a lot about what is going on with our climate or what is causing it.There are some unusual patterns developing but if&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Perhaps on a scale of 20 to 30 years,there seems to be unusual patterns, though when viewed on a longer timeframe these patterns are not so unusual.</p>
<p>With that said, we have opportunities to improve efficiencies and reduce our consumption, and in ways that can benefit our poorer and oppressed neighbors around the world. Imagine the health of our economy and growth if the desperate poor in Africa and Asia could benefit and enjoy some of the comfort and stability we take for granted in the West.</p>
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		<title>By: Pinky</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-72464</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Pinky]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Feb 2010 16:50:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-72464</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I checked your links and other sources.  It&#039;s significant that the recent warming shows up strongest in data and graphs of five-year moving averages ending in the middle of the last decade.  Annualized data is more ambiguous, with recent years showing a leveling off, with only a slight rise or decline.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I checked your links and other sources.  It&#8217;s significant that the recent warming shows up strongest in data and graphs of five-year moving averages ending in the middle of the last decade.  Annualized data is more ambiguous, with recent years showing a leveling off, with only a slight rise or decline.</p>
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		<title>By: Morning's Minion</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-72445</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Morning's Minion]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Feb 2010 02:35:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-72445</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Pinky,

You are confusing a denial that climate change is real, rooted in the dubious American dominant theology - think Calvinism with a whiff of voluntarism - and the political difficulties in putting a price on carbon, which are huge. This is exactly why we need a GLOBAL agreement. 

But I must take you to task for one statement - the temperature has been cooling for a decade. Honestly, where do you get this stuff. Consider the analysis in the &lt;a href=&quot;http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;attached&lt;/a&gt; and look at the &lt;a href=&quot;http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs/Fig.A2.txt&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;deviation&lt;/a&gt; in global surface air temperature through 2009 from the 1951-1980 baseline - you will see global warming at an accelerating pace over the past decade. And you can trace this directly to the amount of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, as countries like India and Chian develop at a rapid pace. This is simply using reason.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pinky,</p>
<p>You are confusing a denial that climate change is real, rooted in the dubious American dominant theology &#8211; think Calvinism with a whiff of voluntarism &#8211; and the political difficulties in putting a price on carbon, which are huge. This is exactly why we need a GLOBAL agreement. </p>
<p>But I must take you to task for one statement &#8211; the temperature has been cooling for a decade. Honestly, where do you get this stuff. Consider the analysis in the <a href="http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs/" rel="nofollow">attached</a> and look at the <a href="http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs/Fig.A2.txt" rel="nofollow">deviation</a> in global surface air temperature through 2009 from the 1951-1980 baseline &#8211; you will see global warming at an accelerating pace over the past decade. And you can trace this directly to the amount of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, as countries like India and Chian develop at a rapid pace. This is simply using reason.</p>
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		<title>By: Rodak</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-72444</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Rodak]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Feb 2010 02:35:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-72444</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The primary greenhouse gas is water? What&#039;s your point there?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The primary greenhouse gas is water? What&#8217;s your point there?</p>
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		<title>By: Pinky</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-72440</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Pinky]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Feb 2010 01:05:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-72440</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[MM - Only in America?  The Czech president has called global warming a myth, and the Rudd government in Australia may be thrown out of office on this issue.

Your first point is indisputable.  Your second point is wrong, as the primary greenhouse gas is water vapor, and we&#039;re still unsure how much effect each of the gases has (separately and together).  As for your third point, you can&#039;t really say that the planet is warming at an accelerated rate, as it&#039;s been cooling for about a decade.  We can&#039;t even say that the earth is on a trend line of warming at an unprecedented rate.  And as the current models failed to predict the current cooling, there&#039;s reason for healthy skepticism.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>MM &#8211; Only in America?  The Czech president has called global warming a myth, and the Rudd government in Australia may be thrown out of office on this issue.</p>
<p>Your first point is indisputable.  Your second point is wrong, as the primary greenhouse gas is water vapor, and we&#8217;re still unsure how much effect each of the gases has (separately and together).  As for your third point, you can&#8217;t really say that the planet is warming at an accelerated rate, as it&#8217;s been cooling for about a decade.  We can&#8217;t even say that the earth is on a trend line of warming at an unprecedented rate.  And as the current models failed to predict the current cooling, there&#8217;s reason for healthy skepticism.</p>
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		<title>By: Morning's Minion</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-72413</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Morning's Minion]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 17:40:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-72413</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Pinky, I can&#039;t believe I have to say this (only in America!), but (i) the greenhouse gas effect - that greenhouse gas emissions lead to warming - is indisputable, established science; (ii) that humanity has been spewing out these emissions at an exponential rate is also indisputable; (iii) the planet is measurably warming at an accelerating pace, and these are measurable changes, not anecdotes about the weather. As I said in the post, we can see the effects today, especially in Africa and other vulnerable reasons. That Americans would wilfully turn a blind eye to this so they can drive their SUVs with cheap gas without guilt is simply beyond me.

Of course, climate change models entail an element of uncertainty. Why in God&#039;s name should this be an argument to bury one&#039;s head in the sand?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pinky, I can&#8217;t believe I have to say this (only in America!), but (i) the greenhouse gas effect &#8211; that greenhouse gas emissions lead to warming &#8211; is indisputable, established science; (ii) that humanity has been spewing out these emissions at an exponential rate is also indisputable; (iii) the planet is measurably warming at an accelerating pace, and these are measurable changes, not anecdotes about the weather. As I said in the post, we can see the effects today, especially in Africa and other vulnerable reasons. That Americans would wilfully turn a blind eye to this so they can drive their SUVs with cheap gas without guilt is simply beyond me.</p>
<p>Of course, climate change models entail an element of uncertainty. Why in God&#8217;s name should this be an argument to bury one&#8217;s head in the sand?</p>
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		<title>By: Pinky</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-72409</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Pinky]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 14:37:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-72409</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Karl Popper said that for something to qualify as science, it must be falsifiable.  Falsifiability means that it is possible for a thing to be proven wrong, not that a thing is wrong.  The theory of gravity can be tested anywhere, and disproven if it&#039;s false, so it falls within the realm of science.  Aquinas&#039;s writings about the angels are probably true, but they can&#039;t be proven right or wrong, so they&#039;re not science.

Anthropogenic climate change is based on models.  Those models haven&#039;t proven themselves to be accurate.  On a popular level, anecdotes about the weather are used as proof of climate change.  The problem is, neither the models nor the anecdotes are falsifiable.  A warm decade is depicted as proof of an unprecedented new trend; a cold decade is written off as sunspots.  A summer storm is depicted as proof of climate change; a winter storm shows that weather is changing, and is also used as proof.

The ironic thing is that you seem to be implying that Gore would have won if election rules were different.  That&#039;s also unfalsifiable.  Every campaign decision is based on the goal of 270 electoral votes.  No campaign in history more conciously targeted the swing voters in the swing states than the 2000 presidential run.  If you want to say that Gore won the popular vote, that&#039;s fine.  It sounds like sour grapes, but it&#039;s fine.  If you want to imply that he deserved to win, well, everything about the campaign would have been different if the goal was 50%+1 voters instead of 50%+1 electoral votes.

As for the resentment I mentioned, that&#039;s bound to show up when people change the rules.  I said that badmouthing the theory based on a few storms is just as irrational as believing in the theory based on a couple of heat waves.  GW skeptics are simply enjoying pointing out the obvious double standard of those who accept the supporting evidence and ignore the opposing evidence.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Karl Popper said that for something to qualify as science, it must be falsifiable.  Falsifiability means that it is possible for a thing to be proven wrong, not that a thing is wrong.  The theory of gravity can be tested anywhere, and disproven if it&#8217;s false, so it falls within the realm of science.  Aquinas&#8217;s writings about the angels are probably true, but they can&#8217;t be proven right or wrong, so they&#8217;re not science.</p>
<p>Anthropogenic climate change is based on models.  Those models haven&#8217;t proven themselves to be accurate.  On a popular level, anecdotes about the weather are used as proof of climate change.  The problem is, neither the models nor the anecdotes are falsifiable.  A warm decade is depicted as proof of an unprecedented new trend; a cold decade is written off as sunspots.  A summer storm is depicted as proof of climate change; a winter storm shows that weather is changing, and is also used as proof.</p>
<p>The ironic thing is that you seem to be implying that Gore would have won if election rules were different.  That&#8217;s also unfalsifiable.  Every campaign decision is based on the goal of 270 electoral votes.  No campaign in history more conciously targeted the swing voters in the swing states than the 2000 presidential run.  If you want to say that Gore won the popular vote, that&#8217;s fine.  It sounds like sour grapes, but it&#8217;s fine.  If you want to imply that he deserved to win, well, everything about the campaign would have been different if the goal was 50%+1 voters instead of 50%+1 electoral votes.</p>
<p>As for the resentment I mentioned, that&#8217;s bound to show up when people change the rules.  I said that badmouthing the theory based on a few storms is just as irrational as believing in the theory based on a couple of heat waves.  GW skeptics are simply enjoying pointing out the obvious double standard of those who accept the supporting evidence and ignore the opposing evidence.</p>
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		<title>By: Cindy</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-72400</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cindy]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 01:32:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-72400</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thank Heavens that someone else out there recognizes the hard right type that Peters is.  It&#039;s Republican Catholic Vote over there, and nothing more.  It&#039;s almost Repuplican first and Catholic Second.  I love that you point out about situations in other countries and how water levels rising, means that they have no place to live anymore, because it&#039;s under water.  It always amazes me that Americans only seem to see what is relevent in their own circumstances, and place.  They have no concern of other people in other nations.  It&#039;s like they don&#039;t exist for them.  I&#039;m not saying all Americans are like this,  but I will say that a majority of hard right wingers are.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank Heavens that someone else out there recognizes the hard right type that Peters is.  It&#8217;s Republican Catholic Vote over there, and nothing more.  It&#8217;s almost Repuplican first and Catholic Second.  I love that you point out about situations in other countries and how water levels rising, means that they have no place to live anymore, because it&#8217;s under water.  It always amazes me that Americans only seem to see what is relevent in their own circumstances, and place.  They have no concern of other people in other nations.  It&#8217;s like they don&#8217;t exist for them.  I&#8217;m not saying all Americans are like this,  but I will say that a majority of hard right wingers are.</p>
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		<title>By: Frank</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/02/18/climate-change-snow-and-africa/#comment-72399</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Frank]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Feb 2010 23:49:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11887#comment-72399</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Magdalena:

Lovely name btw, the name of my late saintly grandmother.  But I digress. I have no ax to grind one way or the other with climate change but I do think if we err, it should be on the side of caution.  Guess that makes me a (gasp) &quot;liberal&quot; since conservatives--at least the loudest ones--seem anxious to dismiss it outright despite the inherently conservative principles you mentioned. Sure, some individuals stand to be enriched by the world going green just as others would continue to be enriched by leaving things as they are. One way or the other, &lt;i&gt;somebody&lt;/i&gt; is going to be enriched. That&#039;s life.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Magdalena:</p>
<p>Lovely name btw, the name of my late saintly grandmother.  But I digress. I have no ax to grind one way or the other with climate change but I do think if we err, it should be on the side of caution.  Guess that makes me a (gasp) &#8220;liberal&#8221; since conservatives&#8211;at least the loudest ones&#8211;seem anxious to dismiss it outright despite the inherently conservative principles you mentioned. Sure, some individuals stand to be enriched by the world going green just as others would continue to be enriched by leaving things as they are. One way or the other, <i>somebody</i> is going to be enriched. That&#8217;s life.</p>
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