Comments on: Snow, Guns, and Hummers

By: Magdalena

Magdalena — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 17:15:55 +0000

Well, the fact is yes, in the United States one does have the right to own a Hummer, and one does have a right to drive it in the snow. You know, your pesonal taste is not a useful measure here. You think it’s an obnoxious behemouth and I agree, but other people think differently. I’m sure we could come up with a debate about how physically large a vehicle can be before Christian ethics are compromised, but that would be theologically constipated.

The gun I’m not sure about – are off-duty officers allowed to carry around their weapons? I would hope not but who knows. Definitely shouldn’t be waving it at people. What he should have done is stay in his car, call the police and have the brats either arrested or dispersed.

Ironically I read an article today about two college students who have been charged with felonies for throwing snowballs at a plow and an undercover police car. While I think that’s overkill, it really does qualify as an assault.

I fall into the category of working poor and you won’t get any argument from me about living wage, job security etc.

By: Michael J. Iafrate

Michael J. Iafrate — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 18:59:40 +0000

MM – Oh, it was not unforeseen for me. I was just waiting for Darwin to turn it around this way, calling the crowd “racist,” and he did not disappoint. Nor did S.B. who quickly spoke up, following his leader, taking it to a new level of absurdity and, frankly, offensiveness.

By: Morning's Minion

Morning's Minion — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 18:44:17 +0000

First off, Magdalena, this was a Saturday afternoon in the middle of a major snowfall. The city was practically shut down. The cop was not on official business, he was not on duty, he was not responding to an emergency situation. He was recklessly driving an obnoxious behemoth through the city streets in a snowstorm on personal business – because it’s his “right”, you see? What is more dangerous, more anti-social – having fun with snowballs or driving a Hummer in the snow with a gun in your pocket?

A final point- yes, we have a major problem with the working poor who are forced to work 2-3 jobs simply to keep up in this economy that does not place much weight on a living wage, affordable healthcare, job security, sufficient paid leave to spend time with family..if this is the debate you want, I’m ready.

By: Magdalena

Magdalena — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 18:29:16 +0000

Darwin, of course the “kids” (adults) in the video are middle class. Probably upper-middle class. Working class adults are too busy, you know, working, and don’t have parents who can subsidize lesiurely mid-afternoon snowball fights.

By: Paul DuBois

Paul DuBois — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 17:38:33 +0000

I realize I am coming a little late in this post and most won’t see this, but I had to comment because I was involved in a similar incident in college. First let me say I do support our police, we ask them to do things for us few of us are willing to do. But because we give them great latitude, we do need to hold them to a pretty high standard.
30 years ago a large group of us were involved in a snowball fight at the University of Detroit after a party. Some of the people involved began throwing snowballs at the passing cars, even at the time I thought this a little irresponsible, but we were just kids. On of the passing cars came around a second time and the passenger in the car shot one of the students in the arm, inflicting a flesh wound, nothing serious. At the time we considered the shooter a criminal, when he was caught he was treated as one. The very fact of pointing a gun at someone in the same circumstance in my mind is not much less serious than actually shooting it since it could easily go off and policemen are taught to not point a gun unless you know you could be using it. The sad thing is that simply because he is a policeman he will not be treated like a criminal and that fails to hold him to a high standard.

By: DarwinCatholic

DarwinCatholic — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 16:41:15 +0000

I don’t think he thought the people pelting and insulting him were likely to lynch him — nor did I say that. I’m not really sure where you got that from. (Nor does it look like they were kids, they all look like they’re in their 20s to me. How you can tell they’re middle class, and what particular virtue there is to that, I’m not really sure.) But that doesn’t necessarily mean that racial issues didn’t play into what happened at all.

Far be it from me to criticize someone for being colorblind, but somehow it seems to me that folks here _would_ have noticed the races of people involved if a white police officer had drawn his gun in response to being pelted with snowballs and taunted by a crowd of black teenagers.

Look at it from the cop’s point of view. He’s diving along, minding his own business, under difficult weather conditions when a crowd starts pelting his vehicle with snowballs, forcing him to stop. When he gets out of his car, he is himself taunted and pelted with snowballs.

Now, maybe everyone here understands race relations in America much better than I do, but it seems to me that if a black police officer is trying to deal with people breaking the law (it is, after all, illegal to pelt moving cars with snowballs) and finds and entire crowd of white people mocking him and pelting him with snowballs, he may see them as rejecting his authority because of his race. And that may make him angry. Just sayin’…

By: Morning's Minion

Morning's Minion — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 16:16:59 +0000

Oh, this is rich, and – I must admit – wholly unforeseen. Yes, when I wrote this post, it certainly never occurred to me to pay any attention to the race of the verious sides. Indeed, I find it laughable. To even hint that this aggressive man reacted the way he did because he thought a bunch of middle-class white kids were about to lynch him is offensive on so many levels.

And by the way, my ideal situation would be an unarmed police force, as works well in many countries. A pipe dream? Perhaps, but first we need to eradicate this evil gun culture, a culture that idolizes the big man with the gun.

By: S.B.

S.B. — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 14:53:11 +0000

Should have said “potentially racist,” rather than “racist,” but then again, you usually claim racism over far less than yelling “f*** pig” in a black person’s face.

By: S.B.

S.B. — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 14:51:56 +0000

Yeah, Michael, when an unruly crowd of racist white people start the situation by assaulting a black police officer, it’s “understandable” that he might feel threatened and then overreact in response. There’s a long history of white mobs oppressing black people in this country, and that indelibly affects the way that black people perceive certain situations.

By: DarwinCatholic

DarwinCatholic — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 14:44:19 +0000

And yes, since I’m sure it needs staying around here lest one be accused of thinking that drawing a gun is the correct response to being snowballed by an rude crowd, I do think the cop was wrong to pull his gun so quickly. Though clearly, it’s his job to clear a crowd that’s risking causing accidents by snowballing moving vehicles. In that regard, drawing his radio and calling for backup was the wiser course.

By: DarwinCatholic

DarwinCatholic — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 14:41:29 +0000

It strikes me as interesting that a mostly white crowd stops a black policeman by throwing snowballs at his vehicle – the crowd them mocks him, calls him a “pig”, and pelts him with snowballs, and MM’s comment is, “it is no coincidence that this aggressive man both drives a hummer and is eager to wave a gun in peoples’ faces.”

Does MM see black men as being particularly aggresive? Does he, as the crowd apparently does, have a problem with a black man being in a position of authority in relation to a crowd which is amusing itself by pelting moving vehicles with snowballs?

And where exactly does the whole “this is the result of the gun culture” angle come from? The guy’s a cop. According to gun control advocates, he’s the only person who ought to have a gun.

By: Ronald King

Ronald King — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 11:51:08 +0000

Magdalena, I meant to say that pulling a gun was more than an overreaction. It was insane. It is easy to label and much harder to understand compassionately.