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	<title>Comments on: Congratulations Brown</title>
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	<description>Catholic perspectives on culture, society, and politics</description>
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		<title>By: Man Bites Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Why I&#8217;m Picking on MCFL</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-70034</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Man Bites Blog &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Why I&#8217;m Picking on MCFL]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 Jan 2010 15:55:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-70034</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] I first saw rumbling about this, I initially dismissed it as more of the usual [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I first saw rumbling about this, I initially dismissed it as more of the usual [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Kurt</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69920</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kurt]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jan 2010 23:07:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69920</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Pinky,

I think the NRTLC&#039;s views on abortion are well known.  I showed that they can run for four paragraphs harranging about the need to elect a pro-abortionist in order to stop 30 million Americans from getting health insurance.  

My point is that when you are buying in to the leading (and one of the more moderate) Pro-Life organizations, you are also signing up to oppose health care reform, oppose campaign finance reform, oppose reducing the costs of prescription drugs for seniors and for the support of the election of Republicans be they pro-abortion or anti-abortion.  

For those who hold all of those views, they have a great organization in the NRTLC.  For many of the rest of us, they go on the list of organizations we oppose.  

I am not asking or expecting you to quit the NRTLC.  I am just explaining why I oppose them.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pinky,</p>
<p>I think the NRTLC&#8217;s views on abortion are well known.  I showed that they can run for four paragraphs harranging about the need to elect a pro-abortionist in order to stop 30 million Americans from getting health insurance.  </p>
<p>My point is that when you are buying in to the leading (and one of the more moderate) Pro-Life organizations, you are also signing up to oppose health care reform, oppose campaign finance reform, oppose reducing the costs of prescription drugs for seniors and for the support of the election of Republicans be they pro-abortion or anti-abortion.  </p>
<p>For those who hold all of those views, they have a great organization in the NRTLC.  For many of the rest of us, they go on the list of organizations we oppose.  </p>
<p>I am not asking or expecting you to quit the NRTLC.  I am just explaining why I oppose them.</p>
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		<title>By: Pinky</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69914</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Pinky]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jan 2010 22:34:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69914</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Kurt, you pared down the statement to eliminate mention of abortion, then used the statement to show that the NRLC doesn&#039;t care about abortion?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kurt, you pared down the statement to eliminate mention of abortion, then used the statement to show that the NRLC doesn&#8217;t care about abortion?</p>
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		<title>By: Kurt</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69903</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kurt]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jan 2010 21:07:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69903</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I pared down the statement in the interest of brevery.  But David is right.  Wading through NRTLC official website, it is clear they simply do not want 30 million uninsured Americans to have health insurance.  To do so could mean that the rich and big corporations might have to pay slightly higher taxes for the benefit of people other than themselves.  Much more importantly, it would give workers and the unemployed some security that their health care needs would be taken care of rather than living one lay-off notice away of being uninsured.  With that security, they might actually feel more confident to speak up on the job, to report workplace safety and fair labor standards act violations, to expect to be treated with human dignity by their bosses and to object to abuse, sexual harrasment and racism.  

And that, the NRTLC and the rest of the right wing finds unacceptable.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I pared down the statement in the interest of brevery.  But David is right.  Wading through NRTLC official website, it is clear they simply do not want 30 million uninsured Americans to have health insurance.  To do so could mean that the rich and big corporations might have to pay slightly higher taxes for the benefit of people other than themselves.  Much more importantly, it would give workers and the unemployed some security that their health care needs would be taken care of rather than living one lay-off notice away of being uninsured.  With that security, they might actually feel more confident to speak up on the job, to report workplace safety and fair labor standards act violations, to expect to be treated with human dignity by their bosses and to object to abuse, sexual harrasment and racism.  </p>
<p>And that, the NRTLC and the rest of the right wing finds unacceptable.</p>
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		<title>By: David Nickol</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69895</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[David Nickol]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jan 2010 19:56:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69895</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Pinky,

It seems to me the pieces you quote that were missing from Kurt&#039;s version are as damning as the rest of it. The value of the abortion debate was not in placing restriction on abortion, or raising awareness, or getting the Stupak Amendment passed. The abortion issue was &quot;absolutely critical to slowing down the out-of-control Obama/Reid/Pelosi train.&quot; 

The statement in its entirety clearly emphasizes the value of killing health care reform, not limiting abortion. Abortion is at best a secondary issue.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pinky,</p>
<p>It seems to me the pieces you quote that were missing from Kurt&#8217;s version are as damning as the rest of it. The value of the abortion debate was not in placing restriction on abortion, or raising awareness, or getting the Stupak Amendment passed. The abortion issue was &#8220;absolutely critical to slowing down the out-of-control Obama/Reid/Pelosi train.&#8221; </p>
<p>The statement in its entirety clearly emphasizes the value of killing health care reform, not limiting abortion. Abortion is at best a secondary issue.</p>
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		<title>By: Pinky</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69891</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Pinky]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jan 2010 19:42:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69891</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.nrlc.org/News_and_Views/Jan10/nv012010.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt; NRLC&#039;s &quot;Today&#039;s News and Views&quot;&lt;/a&gt; included the quotes that Kurt cited.  It also contained passages about abortion that don&#039;t appear in Kurt&#039;s citation.  The portion replaced by ellipses which follows &quot;chills up and down your spine&quot; reads as follows:

&lt;i&gt;One outcome of last night&#039;s special election is to increase the likelihood that the public has a chance to digest this massive initiative.

Second, debate over the abortion issue--which took place, thanks to you--was absolutely critical to slowing down the out-of-control Obama/Reid/Pelosi train. Pelosi made it clear that she had no intention of allowing a vote on the Stupak-Pitts amendment which would prevent federal subsidies for abortion by applying the principles of longstanding federal laws such as the Hyde Amendment to the new programs created by the health care legislation.

When this stance proved untenable, Pelosi reluctantly agreed to allow a vote, all the time making it clear she opposed it and would try to defeat the amendment. The Stupak-Pitts amendment passed 240 to 194 . An equivalent was defeated in the Senate. Which brings us back to &quot;the morning after.&quot;

Contrary to what some are saying, we are not &quot;back to square one,&quot; because of last night&#039;s stunning victory by Brown. (And it was amazing. Republicans had not won an open Senate seat in Massachusetts since 1966; the entire congressional delegation is Democratic; and Coakley was ahead by 30 points in polls taken just a few weeks ago.)&lt;/i&gt;

I don&#039;t know if Kurt deliberately removed the portions of the statement (which apparently was NOT made at their press conference, and appears in a blog, not as an &quot;official statement&quot;).  I&#039;ve seen excerpts taken from the original piece elsewhere.  It could easily be that someone else cut-and-pasted the parts that interested them, which excluded the detailed discussion of the status of abortion in the health care bill, and passed it around the internet.  But this version doesn&#039;t do the NRLC justice.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.nrlc.org/News_and_Views/Jan10/nv012010.html" rel="nofollow"> NRLC&#8217;s &#8220;Today&#8217;s News and Views&#8221;</a> included the quotes that Kurt cited.  It also contained passages about abortion that don&#8217;t appear in Kurt&#8217;s citation.  The portion replaced by ellipses which follows &#8220;chills up and down your spine&#8221; reads as follows:</p>
<p><i>One outcome of last night&#8217;s special election is to increase the likelihood that the public has a chance to digest this massive initiative.</p>
<p>Second, debate over the abortion issue&#8211;which took place, thanks to you&#8211;was absolutely critical to slowing down the out-of-control Obama/Reid/Pelosi train. Pelosi made it clear that she had no intention of allowing a vote on the Stupak-Pitts amendment which would prevent federal subsidies for abortion by applying the principles of longstanding federal laws such as the Hyde Amendment to the new programs created by the health care legislation.</p>
<p>When this stance proved untenable, Pelosi reluctantly agreed to allow a vote, all the time making it clear she opposed it and would try to defeat the amendment. The Stupak-Pitts amendment passed 240 to 194 . An equivalent was defeated in the Senate. Which brings us back to &#8220;the morning after.&#8221;</p>
<p>Contrary to what some are saying, we are not &#8220;back to square one,&#8221; because of last night&#8217;s stunning victory by Brown. (And it was amazing. Republicans had not won an open Senate seat in Massachusetts since 1966; the entire congressional delegation is Democratic; and Coakley was ahead by 30 points in polls taken just a few weeks ago.)</i></p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know if Kurt deliberately removed the portions of the statement (which apparently was NOT made at their press conference, and appears in a blog, not as an &#8220;official statement&#8221;).  I&#8217;ve seen excerpts taken from the original piece elsewhere.  It could easily be that someone else cut-and-pasted the parts that interested them, which excluded the detailed discussion of the status of abortion in the health care bill, and passed it around the internet.  But this version doesn&#8217;t do the NRLC justice.</p>
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		<title>By: Kurt</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69889</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kurt]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jan 2010 19:32:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69889</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Gordie --

I&#039;m not of the school that thinks it is a scandal. 

They are a right-wing, multi-issue organization.  They take positions on campaign finance reform (against), negotiating cheaper drug prices for seniors on Medicare (against) Childrens Health Insurance program (against).  They work with the Republican Party but not with the Democratic Party to recruit favorable candidates and follow a generally anti-government action/pro-private enterprise philosophy.  

They have every right to exist and promote their views.  

I happen to disagree with them and view them as a force for injustice in our society.  And I have a right to promote my views as much as they do.  

They have gone on my list (Planned Parenthod has been there for decades) of groups that when they send me solictations, I ripped them up and send it back using the Business Reply enevelope they send me.  That 50 cents less they then have to advance their right wing agenda.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gordie &#8211;</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not of the school that thinks it is a scandal. </p>
<p>They are a right-wing, multi-issue organization.  They take positions on campaign finance reform (against), negotiating cheaper drug prices for seniors on Medicare (against) Childrens Health Insurance program (against).  They work with the Republican Party but not with the Democratic Party to recruit favorable candidates and follow a generally anti-government action/pro-private enterprise philosophy.  </p>
<p>They have every right to exist and promote their views.  </p>
<p>I happen to disagree with them and view them as a force for injustice in our society.  And I have a right to promote my views as much as they do.  </p>
<p>They have gone on my list (Planned Parenthod has been there for decades) of groups that when they send me solictations, I ripped them up and send it back using the Business Reply enevelope they send me.  That 50 cents less they then have to advance their right wing agenda.</p>
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		<title>By: Gordie</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69888</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gordie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jan 2010 18:34:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69888</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Excerpt from &quot;Mission Statement for the National Right To Life Committee&quot;

http://www.nrlc.org/Missionstatement.htm

&quot;The National Right to Life Committee has been instrumental in achieving a number of legislative reforms at the national level, including a ban on non-therapeutic experimentation of unborn and newborn babies, a federal conscience clause guaranteeing medical personnel the right to refuse to participate in abortion procedures, and various amendments to appropriations bills which prohibit (or limit) the use of federal funds to subsidize or promote abortions in the United States and overseas.

The ultimate goal of the National Right to Life Committee is to restore legal protection to innocent human life. The primary interest of the National Right to Life Committee and its members has been the abortion controversy; however, it is also concerned with related matters of medical ethics which relate to the right to life issues of euthanasia and infanticide. The Committee does not have a position on issues such as contraception, sex education, capital punishment, and national defense.&quot;

I think based on their stated mission statement that supporting Brown as a Senator is plausible, since the Healthcare Bill would more likely than not include the &quot;use of federal funds to subsidize or promote abortions in the United States and overseas&quot;

I couldn&#039;t find a press conference or release from the National Right To Life Committee substantiating what Kurt wrote.


Is this a scandal?  Nope, they are just following there mission statement.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excerpt from &#8220;Mission Statement for the National Right To Life Committee&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.nrlc.org/Missionstatement.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.nrlc.org/Missionstatement.htm</a></p>
<p>&#8220;The National Right to Life Committee has been instrumental in achieving a number of legislative reforms at the national level, including a ban on non-therapeutic experimentation of unborn and newborn babies, a federal conscience clause guaranteeing medical personnel the right to refuse to participate in abortion procedures, and various amendments to appropriations bills which prohibit (or limit) the use of federal funds to subsidize or promote abortions in the United States and overseas.</p>
<p>The ultimate goal of the National Right to Life Committee is to restore legal protection to innocent human life. The primary interest of the National Right to Life Committee and its members has been the abortion controversy; however, it is also concerned with related matters of medical ethics which relate to the right to life issues of euthanasia and infanticide. The Committee does not have a position on issues such as contraception, sex education, capital punishment, and national defense.&#8221;</p>
<p>I think based on their stated mission statement that supporting Brown as a Senator is plausible, since the Healthcare Bill would more likely than not include the &#8220;use of federal funds to subsidize or promote abortions in the United States and overseas&#8221;</p>
<p>I couldn&#8217;t find a press conference or release from the National Right To Life Committee substantiating what Kurt wrote.</p>
<p>Is this a scandal?  Nope, they are just following there mission statement.</p>
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		<title>By: Henry Karlson</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69847</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Henry Karlson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 22:28:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69847</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[John

It is indeed a scandal, and I think we have come to some agreement on that point -- and why, even if we might not agree as to when that scandal became evident and a line was crossed. But I do think this is a concern with the pro-life cause and why I think organizations should always remain pure to their essence and not support anyone if there is no one to support; people can make prudential decisions without the organization giving a recommendation, and indeed, if they don&#039;t always do so, they become someone to be courted instead of the one doing the courting, as I fear we see going on now.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John</p>
<p>It is indeed a scandal, and I think we have come to some agreement on that point &#8212; and why, even if we might not agree as to when that scandal became evident and a line was crossed. But I do think this is a concern with the pro-life cause and why I think organizations should always remain pure to their essence and not support anyone if there is no one to support; people can make prudential decisions without the organization giving a recommendation, and indeed, if they don&#8217;t always do so, they become someone to be courted instead of the one doing the courting, as I fear we see going on now.</p>
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		<title>By: Pinky</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69846</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Pinky]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 22:20:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69846</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Kurt - link?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kurt &#8211; link?</p>
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		<title>By: johnmcg</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69845</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[johnmcg]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 22:14:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69845</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Well, they can never claim with credibility that abortion ought to be the only, overriding issue ever again.

I do plan on writing them, because this is a scandal.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, they can never claim with credibility that abortion ought to be the only, overriding issue ever again.</p>
<p>I do plan on writing them, because this is a scandal.</p>
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		<title>By: Kurt</title>
		<link>http://vox-nova.com/2010/01/20/congratulations-brown/#comment-69840</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kurt]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 21:41:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://vox-nova.com/?p=11587#comment-69840</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Today&#039;s press conference held by the NRTL Committee made it quite clear that they are simply an organization dedicated to oppose universal health care with abortion as a secondary concern.  Here is their offical statement on the Senate race: 

&lt;i&gt;What matters today is Scott Brown ran on a you-know-my-meaning opposition to health care restructuring. He would be vote &quot;41,&quot; he vowed, meaning the Democrats would no longer have a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate. Those 60 votes had proved an irresistible temptation to try to ram through a proposal with no Republican input and no public mandate.

Don&#039;t forget, Obama, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, and House Speaker Nancy Pelosi intended to pass this legislation by last August. No matter where you are coming from politically, the notion of refashioning a sixth of the entire economy with virtually no in-depth conversation and analysis ought to send chills up and down your spine...

Obama and his apologists are furiously spinning last night&#039;s outcome as the product of a flawed candidate (Coakley) and an opponent (Brown) whom Massachusetts&#039; voters didn&#039;t &quot;really&quot; know. (Hint, hint: extremist). It was nothing of the sort, any more than were the elections of Bob McDonnell for governor of Virginia and Chris Christie for governor of New Jersey. 

To the contrary these were referenda on Obama and his health care &quot;reform&quot; about clear as it is humanly possible to get. The American public, as measured by a raft of opinion polls, had already signaled its rejection of Obamacare.

So, too, have the voters of Virginia, New Jersey, and Massachusetts.&lt;/i&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Today&#8217;s press conference held by the NRTL Committee made it quite clear that they are simply an organization dedicated to oppose universal health care with abortion as a secondary concern.  Here is their offical statement on the Senate race: </p>
<p><i>What matters today is Scott Brown ran on a you-know-my-meaning opposition to health care restructuring. He would be vote &#8220;41,&#8221; he vowed, meaning the Democrats would no longer have a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate. Those 60 votes had proved an irresistible temptation to try to ram through a proposal with no Republican input and no public mandate.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t forget, Obama, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, and House Speaker Nancy Pelosi intended to pass this legislation by last August. No matter where you are coming from politically, the notion of refashioning a sixth of the entire economy with virtually no in-depth conversation and analysis ought to send chills up and down your spine&#8230;</p>
<p>Obama and his apologists are furiously spinning last night&#8217;s outcome as the product of a flawed candidate (Coakley) and an opponent (Brown) whom Massachusetts&#8217; voters didn&#8217;t &#8220;really&#8221; know. (Hint, hint: extremist). It was nothing of the sort, any more than were the elections of Bob McDonnell for governor of Virginia and Chris Christie for governor of New Jersey. </p>
<p>To the contrary these were referenda on Obama and his health care &#8220;reform&#8221; about clear as it is humanly possible to get. The American public, as measured by a raft of opinion polls, had already signaled its rejection of Obamacare.</p>
<p>So, too, have the voters of Virginia, New Jersey, and Massachusetts.</i></p>
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