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The Day After

November 5, 2008
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I would like to say I’m jubilant today.  I’m not.  Yes, “my candidate” won last night and convincingly, even if not by my optimistic forecast.  This is not to say that I regret my vote even though my wife and I cancelled each other out.  I do believe the better candidate won last night.  I never confused him for the perfect candidate though.  A two-year window opened today that will hopefully result in a lot of good.

With the margins for the Democrats in the House and Senate, it is my sincere hope that we can finally get the health care reform we so badly need.  I hope Paul Volcker continues on in an Obama White House in some capacity such as Treasury Security.  I hope we can now begin the process of disengaging and withdrawing from Iraq.  I hope our future foreign policy will be guided more by conciliation than by righteous preening.  I also hope the Democrats recognize – and I think the conservative Democrats in the House do recognize – that support from pro-lifers helped make this election possible and act accordingly.

Treat this as an open thread for your own thoughts and reflections.  Just don’t bore me.

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50 Comments
  1. November 5, 2008 10:10 am

    I’m tired of just how reactionary the American people are. Once you leave the coasts, you’re on your own. Something like 1/4 of Obama voters in California voted to ban gay marriage – minorities in particular, esp. blacks.

    I’m tired of the Obama cultists. The only consolation is that
    – they’re in for a rude awakening
    and
    – that Focus on the Family, Catholic Church, Mormons are rather SOL now on a federal level, even though they managed to score some local victories by appealing to people’s basest instincts.

    I’m tired of the hysterical style of politics unique to the USA, where pressure groups, from NARAL to Evangelicals whip people into a frenzy. Not to mention that the idea of donating money to parties/candidates is a strange one.

    The naivite of the electorate is almost touching. In a duopoly, the choices are limited to who one hates. That and whether one would like ‘fries with that’. The various religious groups, incl. the laughable KofC (Gilbert and Sullivan called, they want their costumes back) affirm their relevance in none both despicable ways, in a manner seen only in the USA and Poland.

    I’m tired of the American political system, where 50.1% can change a constitution, no third party has a chance, the ‘winner takes all’, where the ‘Electoral College’ still exists but the metric system does not, votes aren’t added nationwide, where Iowa straw polls matter, where one doesn’t need ID to vote and so forth.

    It’s good to see the Republicans out of power. It’s disconcerting that the Democrats now have total control on every level. It’s good to see that bigotry towards gay people is literally dying out, as young people overwhelmingly reject it.

    Checking California county by county, I was surprised at the reactionary backwaters that can be found, mostly inland but also far South. Granted, my NorCal relatives/friends are very dittoheadish liberals, but at least they don’t gp around curtailing other people’s rights.

    Now excuse me, as I have to learn the hymns in honor of the Great Leader. One has a line about pulling out a baby ‘by its cold dead hands’.

    Well, I’ll be vacationing in Europe soon, Spain and Austria. This election, with its combination of leftism and conservative bigotry calls for it. As far as SoCal is concerned, I guess “Life in the OC” requires cross-burning.

  2. blackadderiv permalink
    November 5, 2008 10:12 am

    My greatest disappointment is that the state of Washington legalized assisted suicide last night. Michigan apparently approved state funding for embryo-destroying research as well. It’s sickening.

    Volcker would be a good choice for Treasury Secretary, as would Larry Summers. But if Obama picks Jon Corzine, I’m going to have a conniption fit. The last thing we need as *another* guy from Goldman Sachs in that position.

  3. RedFly permalink
    November 5, 2008 10:14 am

    Nancy Keenan, president of NARAL Pro-Choice America, is cetainly jubiliant this morning, and with good reason. Here is her statement:

    “Tonight marks the beginning of a new era for America, with a leader in the White House who respects women’s ability to make personal, private decisions,” Keenan said. “Sen. Obama’s strong support for a woman’s right to choose galvanized voters across the country. The clear contrast between Obama’s pro-choice values and John McCain’s extreme anti-choice record made an enormous difference in this race. Sen. Obama’s visionary pledge to change the tone of the debate over reproductive rights struck a chord with Americans looking for a leader to move the country away from the divisive attacks and rhetoric that have dominated our nation’s political process for the last eight years. As the first major pro-choice organization to endorse Sen. Obama, we are proud of our members who volunteered for his campaign and whose support made it possible for us to persuade key swing voters to support his candidacy in all 50 states. We look forward to working with our new pro-choice president in protecting women’s health and privacy.”

    Congratulations to Nancy, M.Z. Forrest, Morning’s Minion, radicalcatholicmom, and all those responsible for Obama’s big win.

  4. blackadderiv permalink
    November 5, 2008 10:17 am

    Also, we get to keep Ted Stevens but not Liddy Dole? Not a good night.

  5. kurt permalink
    November 5, 2008 10:19 am

    Today is a great day for America and for the world. We have elected an outstanding, devout, intelligent, compassionate and able man as our leader. Once again, God has blessed our nation.

    But greater than the many outstanding virtues of the President-elect, is the fact we have continued our practice of more than 200 years of doing something most of the world and most of history has not seen — a free people governing themselves, choosing their own leaders and implementing the peaceful transition of power without violence, force or bloodshed. Maybe we have become accustomed to it, but it is a remarkable feat. If you believe in peace, you should believe in democracy.

    The President-Elect has reached out to his former opponent and asked for his assistance. John McCain will remain a respected member of the United States Senate and continue to be a voice for many important ideas and issues. Our country is blessed by his service as well as Senator Obama’s.

    We too have our role. We have the opportunity, if we so decide, to work with our new president and help him do what is best for our country. We did not elect a King or Caudillo or Pasha or Prelate. We elected a President according to our Constitution. He serves the people; he does not rule over them. Our system of government is a participatory system. And the participatory role of the citizenry does not end on election day. Americans will be called to serve on the Transition Team, in the new Administration, and as leaders of the civic dialogue necessary as the new Administration puts forward its proposals to the American people. Now would be a good time to decide if one is willing to work WITH the new Administration to help better our country or to sit it out. Senator McCain has, as is his nature, chosen the honorable response to this question. I hope others will too.

  6. November 5, 2008 10:24 am

    “Today is a great day for America and for the world. We have elected an outstanding, devout, intelligent, compassionate and able man as our leader. Once again, God has blessed our nation.”

    I didn’t know they’d already started doing lobotomies. I better drive to Canada once more, before the hybrid black helicopters come for me, too.

  7. Christopher permalink
    November 5, 2008 10:30 am

    Despite my disappointment, I am genuinely happy in the face that we have crossed that final racial barrier as a nation — last night a black man became President in a nation where once he would have been a slave.

    Apparently there are no “red states, blue states” in California, Florida and Arizona when it comes to redefining marriage. Another cause for rejoicing?

  8. c matt permalink
    November 5, 2008 10:38 am

    Well, I wouldn’t hold my breath on that last item of yours, MZ. I wish the Big O lotsa luck with running the country over the next 4 years – he’s gonna need it.

    With any luck, there are enough opposition pols left in Congress to block anything, and hopefully nothing gets done. Whether or not God has blessed our nation remains to be seen – I think He has given us exactly what we wanted, and we deserve it.

  9. November 5, 2008 10:46 am

    “Apparently there are no “red states, blue states” in California, Florida and Arizona when it comes to redefining marriage. Another cause for rejoicing?”

    Your days of bigotry are numbered, I’m afraid, given that the young overwhelmingly support equality. Enjoy them while they last. In California, hicks, blacks and ‘devoutly religious’ supported the ban. Well, it won’t be long before the CA Supreme Court overturns this disgrace. A Prop. changing the constitution by simple majority is a rather despicable thing regardless of the issue.

    I’m not happy about Obama winning, but I am happy about the right wing getting creamed like this, it certainly deserves it.

  10. M.Z. Forrest permalink
    November 5, 2008 10:50 am

    Let’s watch the demagoguery. For all sides involved, it really doesn’t serve a useful purpose at this point. Now is the time to organize so that common interests are better represented in the next election.

  11. November 5, 2008 10:52 am

    I didn’t know they’d already started doing lobotomies. I better drive to Canada once more, before the hybrid black helicopters come for me, too.

    Um, Canadians largely love Obama.

    When they announced him as the projected winner, we heard cheering in the street below, car horns, and police car sirens.

  12. S.B. permalink
    November 5, 2008 11:02 am

    Hopefully this will show MM that there were enough American pro-lifers who voted for Obama despite both their pro-life beliefs and their racism (assumed only because they might have voted for McCain).

  13. blackadderiv permalink
    November 5, 2008 11:04 am

    Your days of bigotry are numbered

    You’ve been saying this for a while now. And yet, it would seem that gay marriage is incapable of carrying the day even in liberal California (I can remember a time, not too long ago, when you would have said such a result was inconceivable). But who knows. Perhaps if the anti-prop. 8 people had put their time to better use than driving around calling people fascists they might have won.

  14. Greg permalink
    November 5, 2008 11:09 am

    What’s wrong with Goldman Sachs?

  15. adamv permalink
    November 5, 2008 11:18 am

    I think the Obama victory represents steps forward for both parties.

    Democrats will have to acknowledge that many Republicans broke with their party to vote for them. If they take their victory as mandate to move ahead on Democratic policies in toto. Obama may not get reelected. So hopefully, we’ll see a tempered approach to policy in the next four years.

    Republicans have finally been given an impetus to re-explore their core principles, and to do so creatively. While I do not think much of deregulation and limited government, I suspect that if Republicans decided that both principles legitimized ended the GOP’s favoritism to the wealthy and supported pro-family wages and employment policies many people would view them favorably again.

    All the same, my wife voted Democratic and I abstained this time around. If anything else, I’m hoping that healthcare reform moves apace.

  16. November 5, 2008 11:23 am

    California per se isn’t liberal. There are a lot of redneck counties here that make you think you’re in Deliverance country.

    As far as gay marriage goes, all it takes is for the current generation of retirees to die off. In the end, equality always wins out. It just takes Americans longer than peoples who aren’t as prone to hysteria. Now, if only a law could be passed forbidding Catholics something :P Oh wait, they already got plenty of that !

    [You've said your piece. Move on.]

  17. Knuckle Dragger permalink
    November 5, 2008 11:37 am

    It’s a very sad day for pro-lifers. The killing of God’s unborn children will worsen under Obama, and the nation doesn’t care. What’s worse, many Catholics don’t seem to care.

    Pray that America has a change of heart.

  18. ctd permalink
    November 5, 2008 11:39 am

    Rednecks? Hicks? Reactionary backwaters? Cross burning?

    Okay, we get that you fail to understand that Catholic opposition to same-sex marriage is not bigotry, but something integral to Catholic social teaching, but doesn’t such name calling amount to bigotry?

  19. November 5, 2008 11:42 am

    I also hope the Democrats recognize – and I think the conservative Democrats in the House do recognize – that support from pro-lifers helped make this election possible and act accordingly.

    I’m curious to know what, if anything, you can show a skeptic like me to persuade me that any Democrat leader feels any obligation to any pro-lifers.

    It is certainly true that pro-lifers, including many, many Catholics, can claim much credit for Obama’s victory.

    Now what are you going to do about it?

    The pro-life movement, politically, is in your hands now. Social conservatives are shut out at the federal level. It’s up to liberals who’ve been claiming all along that they oppose abortion and gay marriage to pick up the ball and run with it within your own party.

    I’d like to see Vox Nova, given your claim to be faithful Catholics, pick up this ball and run with it. Conservative Catholics have been vocal in their criticisms of pro-abort Republican candidates. Now that you’ve participated in such a significant way in this victory, it’s time for you liberal Catholics to make your voices heard on behalf of the voiceless innocents whose slaughter your candidate has promised to facilitate.

    I have a modest example here of what I’m talking about.

    I look forward to seeing your efforts on this score.

  20. M.Z. Forrest permalink
    November 5, 2008 11:56 am

    I don’t have to convince you or anyone else of anything. If you and others want to take your ball and go home, that is your choice but recognize that it will have consequences. The rest of the pro-life movement’s life starts today. They can spend it pissing and moaning or they can do something constructive. Acting like abortion is the only issue isn’t going to help matters. Acting like Obama won last night because people just don’t care about the unborn is provincial, unproductive, and more importantly wrong. Today is the day to once again begin the work toward ending abortion.

  21. November 5, 2008 11:59 am

    Now that you’ve participated in such a significant way in this victory, it’s time for you liberal Catholics to make your voices heard on behalf of the voiceless innocents whose slaughter your candidate has promised to facilitate.

    I agree but I think you overlook the ways that those of us who voted for Obama have done so already.

  22. radicalcatholicmom permalink
    November 5, 2008 12:00 pm

    Paul, conversion takes time. Right now, I am working at my local level with local Democratic leaders to at the very least allow pro-life Dems to vote pro-life when they want to just like the Republicans allow pro-abortion Repubs to vote their conscience. We have to start somewhere. I think the pro-life movement’s greatest mistake was just giving up the Democratic Party without a massive fight to win it back.

    It has taken 35 years to get to where we are. Let me have 35 years to at least try. That is all I ask.

  23. Joseph permalink
    November 5, 2008 12:05 pm

    MZ has already dodged directly answering anything Paul stated. I guess that means he hasn’t dropped the ball, rather he doesn’t even intend on picking it up. I think we figured as much.

  24. S.B. permalink
    November 5, 2008 12:06 pm

    I agree but I think you overlook the ways that those of us who voted for Obama have done so already.

    How? By ridiculing pro-lifers? By making the excuse that you don’t talk about abortion because it’s too obvious? Really effective tactics there.

  25. Jessie permalink
    November 5, 2008 12:10 pm

    So M.Z., what IS your plan of action for promoting pro-life. Abortion may not be “the only issue”, but it is VERY important seeing as it involves the murder of a million plus innocent lives in the USA every year. I have never heard or read any thing that points to any plan of action to stop abortion on this blog. Helping the poor and pregnant is good and is already happening but just what do you bring to the table? Organize people to volunteer at the pregnancy centers? Attend pro-life demonstrations? Work to restrict abortions in every way legally possible? Start a petition to get parental notification and informed consent laws passed in your state? Other that telling us to “stop focusing on abortion”, just what are you going to actually DO? Maybe you guys will start a blog called End Abortion Now! or work to overturn the drive to fund embryonic stem cell research? What are You going to DO? This is not a rhetorical question.

  26. Greg permalink
    November 5, 2008 12:14 pm

    MZ Forrest or Michael Iafrate,

    When was the last time you fasted for the unborn?

  27. M.Z. Forrest permalink
    November 5, 2008 12:21 pm

    Organize people to volunteer at the pregnancy centers? Attend pro-life demonstrations?
    These don’t require the cooperation of politicians.

    Work to restrict abortions in every way legally possible? Start a petition to get parental notification and informed consent laws passed in your state? Other that telling us to “stop focusing on abortion”, just what are you going to actually DO?
    My political agenda in order of importance:
    1) Insure the conscience rights or physicians and hospitals are respected.
    2) Under the existing framework, advocate the outlawing of abortion in the 2nd and 3rd trimesters except in the cases of rape, incest, and life of the mother.
    3) Work toward limiting embryo creation for in vitro fertilization.
    4) Work toward funding stem cell research that doesn’t require the destruction of embryoes.
    5) Work toward proscribing ESCR at State Universities.
    6) Work toward outlawing in vitro fertilization.
    7) Work toward ending all 2nd and 3rd trimester abortions.
    8) Outlaw ESCR research.
    9) Work toward ending 1st trimester abortions.

    As far as the accusatory tone that some have taken about what I’m going to do, save it. Looking for who to blame for your failures is unproductive. Move on.

  28. November 5, 2008 12:40 pm

    I had no intention of taking an accusatory tone. You guys are the winners; I’m not “taking my ball and going home,” but it’s the liberals who elected Obama, and it’s the liberal pro-lifers — if that’s what you are — who the Democrats owe now, as you rightly pointed out in the original post.

    Of course you don’t have to prove anything to me. I simply asked, so that I might understand what you’re referring to.

    I’m not demanding that you get out and do some kind of penance for the “sin” of having voted for Obama. I’m no good at fasting myself.

    I am trying to take you at your word when you say you are pro-life Catholics. Your approach to pro-life Catholicism is not something I understand, and I have not found your arguments for that approach to be persuave.

    But that argument is over now, and you won.

    OK, you’re in the finals now, and as I see it, you have to make a different argument now. Not against the conservatives, but against the pro-aborts of your own party. There is no one else who can make that argument and have a chance of being listened to.

    My question is, will the pro-life Catholics of Vox Nova be using this blog to make the arguments that must be made within the Democratic Party to bring an end to abortion, to prevent the spread of gay marriage, and to bring a true culture of life to a party that to many of us looks like nothing other than a culture of death?

    RCM’s local political efforts are very nice, and I applaud them. But will you guys be writing about these things?

    I live in a state run solely by Democrats. conscience rights were the first things to go after the abolition of the right to life was secured. The governor instituted state funding of ESCR by executive order.

    I think it’s clear that the Church teaches that the unborn have a right to life, and that the born have an obligation to respect that right. Will I see that teaching expounded on this blog for the benefit of Democrats who don’t recognize that right? Because I haven’t seen or heard of such writings here heretofore.

    It’s your blog, guys, run it any way you want. I’m just asking is all.

  29. November 5, 2008 12:50 pm

    Paul

    Here is a part of a piece I wrote for VN internal discussion — I hope it answers your questions:

    “Now is the time to dialogue with Obama on the issue of life. Now that he is victor, the next stage is to work with him. This also means to be critical, to be sure, but also to engage what he has said. I think a petition or letter which quotes ALL that he has said positive about working with pro-lifers for removing the causes of abortion, and even of his support for restrictions on late-term abortion, needs to be made, before he is in office, and somehow got to him. It needs to suggest that 1) FOCA and his quotes do not go hand and hand, and 2) better postpone FOCA and let the dialogue happen and see what comes from it, especially since it would contradict his notion that abortion can be restricted. The time is now. “

  30. Lizaanne permalink
    November 5, 2008 12:52 pm

    . . . the laughable KofC (Gilbert and Sullivan called, they want their costumes back)

    LOL–good one.

  31. Jacero10 permalink
    November 5, 2008 12:57 pm

    “I don’t have to convince you or anyone else of anything. If you and others want to take your ball and go home, that is your choice but recognize that it will have consequences. The rest of the pro-life movement’s life starts today. They can spend it pissing and moaning or they can do something constructive. Acting like abortion is the only issue isn’t going to help matters. Acting like Obama won last night because people just don’t care about the unborn is provincial, unproductive, and more importantly wrong. Today is the day to once again begin the work toward ending abortion.”

    Oh yes, work strenuously for a pro-abort, then tell consistent pro-lifers to take their ball and go home, then urge people to work for life.

    Idiocy to the extreme.

  32. November 5, 2008 1:00 pm

    Well Congrats Obama supporters. It was a hard race.

    I will admit I am not too happy. I think this is a disaster on several fronts but we shall wait and see.

    I will admit I have a lot of bitterness toward Catholics in the political square and that will take some time to overcome. It is not that they supported McCain but never gave McCain a fair shake.

    On the Catholic Justice Issue of the last decade (besides abortion) immigration reform McCain that risked his poltical career got no kudos and in fact the absence of that issue and his leadership was a glaring and I have to think a deliberate omission

    For those Republicans that stood up on that and were Catholic and took a lot of arrows for trying to conform our thoughts to the Church the betrayal some of us feel will take some time getting over.

    WHere McCain stood up on ther issues of Catholic SOcial Justice and took many hits was ignored.

    The issue of Iraq was bizaree. In reality what Obama proposed is not much different (9 or ten months) than what is being negoated now. While many that were screaming Iraq Iraq Iraq they had a very big non interest in Obamas views on Afghanistan and what military we shall do in Pakistan.

    There is still one more Congressional race in this country to be decided and I will vote in it. There will be a pro life Democrat and a Pro Life Republican running. I am very much thinking of voting for the DEM because I like him. Again not putting all our eggs in one basket as many of us are lectured on. Again I am not seeing it from the other side though.

    IN the end will there be a party of Sam Brownbacks in the GOP or will polticians make perhaps a sensible caculation that since when push comes to shove they get nothing for their efforts go opposite.

    In any event Obama is now the President. ANd I trust even those that support him will now unite with those that opposed him to try to stop (though I have no idea we do it) the massive set of Executive orders that Bush signed to protect life and by any necessary stop the Freedom of Choice Act. ON that I think we can agree.

    We shall see what influence people like Kmiec have in this adminsitration in the next couple of years.

    On a happy note the Marriage amendments passed. I think that Obama is much more a practical poltician that is he letting on. Hopefully this will be a sign to him not to fight to repeal DOMA which would be a small victory

  33. Jacero10 permalink
    November 5, 2008 1:04 pm

    Paul, conversion takes time. Right now, I am working at my local level with local Democratic leaders to at the very least allow pro-life Dems to vote pro-life when they want to just like the Republicans allow pro-abortion Repubs to vote their conscience. We have to start somewhere. I think the pro-life movement’s greatest mistake was just giving up the Democratic Party without a massive fight to win it back.

    It has taken 35 years to get to where we are. Let me have 35 years to at least try. That is all I ask.

    Conversion takes a hell of a lot longer when you vote pro-abortion, honey. The way you vote, it won’t take 35 years. It will take forever.

    Apparently, this makes you happy.

    I dont really believe that you are working pro-life in any way. I think you are a shill for Planned Parenthood, placed here to lower the moral standards of Catholics. Well done. But not all of us Catholics will be your sheep.

    I’m not buying what you’re selling, mommy.

  34. November 5, 2008 1:21 pm

    One silver lining is watching the tears roll down Jesse Jackson’s face as he realizes that his race-huckstering gig is over and he’ll need to find a real job. Maybe not. There’s probably a place for him in the Obama administration.

  35. Ressourcement permalink
    November 5, 2008 1:29 pm

    I also hope the Democrats recognize – and I think the conservative Democrats in the House do recognize – that support from pro-lifers helped make this election possible and act accordingly.

    I hope that educated Catholic pro-lifers realize that there were no “proportionate reasons” to cast a vote for a radically pro-abortion presidential candidate, and, as such, they will be held accountable for their neglect of the Church’s voice, and their twisting of the Church’s teaching.

    But other than that, I am looking forward to what he does on health care because I need it.

    –jn

  36. Ressourcement permalink
    November 5, 2008 1:30 pm

    One silver lining is watching the tears roll down Jesse Jackson’s face as he realizes that his race-huckstering gig is over and he’ll need to find a real job. Maybe not. There’s probably a place for him in the Obama administration.

    A place for him? I think they are hiring custodians.

    jn

  37. Jessie permalink
    November 5, 2008 1:35 pm

    M.Z. Yes, you have lofty goals. But what are you DOING? Your distain for personal actions that don’t involve “political cooperation” is weird. After all, those personal actions are how we interact with the day-to-day world of real people in real situations. It is were we meet those making “difficult moral decisions” and have influence to change the outcome in a very real way. Those personal actions change minds and hearts on the ground level. Of course we must have the overarching political goals of ending the culture of death, but you have consistently argued here on Vox Nova that we must first change the “hearts and minds” of people before we can change the laws.

    So I ask again, What are you personally doing to change the hearts and minds of your fellow Americans so that they can see the Truth about the dignity of EVERY human life?

  38. Knuckle Dragger permalink
    November 5, 2008 1:46 pm

    M.Z.,

    By siging the Freedom of Choice Act, Obama will prevent many if not all of your goals from being realized.

  39. Franklin Jennings permalink
    November 5, 2008 4:47 pm

    “It has taken 35 years to get to where we are. Let me have 35 years to at least try. That is all I ask.”

    Sure, if we don’t lose ground in the process. But if, in 8 years, we find abortion enshrined even further into law, especially to the point that faithful Catholics are barred from the practises of healthcare and medicine, those huge setbacks were made possible by you.

    Are you human enough to accept the credit?

  40. Franklin Jennings permalink
    November 5, 2008 5:00 pm

    Or to put it more simply, if I can no longer practice the vocation I am called to in my own country, because of your votes, can I rely on you to help get me somewhere like Uganda where I can still serve in the way I was created for? If the faces you’ve supported drive us out, destroy our right to conscientious objection, what will you do?

    And I say if because, even though my professors are currently gloating that in short order we will be removed from their midst, I still suspect Obama’s just another politician. I hope FOCA never sees passage. But if it does, and you guys aren’t the most vocal opponents in our midst, if you do not work more tirelessly to galvanise us in opposition to this debacle than you did to create it, you will be doubly responsible, you who helped lay the groundwork for the situation.

    You will have to answer for that at the Eschaton. And I would not be your friends if I did not remind you of it.

  41. November 5, 2008 5:01 pm

    Amazing. The election is over and the racist comments continue.

  42. November 5, 2008 5:33 pm

    Just checking in. Michael just talked about racism. Just love how mostly the white leading figures of Catholic Social Justice forget the issue of immigration reform.

    Yeah I am mad about that. I am pretty mad because as McCain was risking his poltical life Obama killed it by a poison pill (Can’t let Bush look good or McCain look good so let the deprotations continue for two years for the greater good or health care or Democrat victory).

    THere was racism here but I am afraid supposly neutral observers “above party” and all the balderdash might not have walked the talk

    Chris Cannon , a huge friend of Immigration reform and vocal opponent of anti Catholic groups, from Utah went down .Not a pip from Catholic SOcial justice Advocates. Sen Lindsey Graham of SC that had horrid ads ran against him and not one call out on any of the Catholic Justice groups mailing list I am on that he was under attack

    It is a huge shame that many Catholic Hispanisc thought that McCain was against them on this issue. Too bad that did not get corrected

    I view this as a huge scandal and while Immigration issues might be boring to many Catholic Justice advocates that talk IRaq and Health Care for those of us that took the arrows we were expecting at least some support or at least publicity on this issue

  43. November 5, 2008 5:54 pm

    I think the pro-life movement’s greatest mistake was just giving up the Democratic Party without a massive fight to win it back.

    Bingo, RCM. The people on the American political right who can be convinced, have been. Time for the Pro-Life movement to start working on the left. There are rich pickings on the left, believe me.

  44. David Nickol permalink
    November 5, 2008 7:02 pm

    jh,

    From what I have read, McCain lost Hispanics over economic issues, not immigration.

  45. November 5, 2008 7:13 pm

    I think Dr. Martin Luther King is looking down and smiling. In a sense, tonight’s victory is his. He saw that non-violence could bring, not crushing of your enemies, but reconciliation; not dominance, but ultimately loving understanding. I heard a white woman on NPR last weekend expressing fears that “blacks would get revenge for they way they’ve been mistreated.” One of the best things about yesterday is that she is going to be proven wrong: one result of Obama’s victory will be, not retribution, but reconciliation.

    Martin Luther King:

    More and more I see this. I’ve seen too much hate to want to hate myself; hate is too great a burden to bear. I’ve seen it on the faces of too many sheriffs of the South. I’ve seen hate. In the faces and even the walk of too many Klansmen of the South, I’ve seen hate. Hate distorts the personality. Hate does something to the soul that causes one to lose his objectivity.

    [T]he Greek language comes out with the word, “agape.” Agape is more than romantic or aesthetic love. Agape is more than friendship. Agape is creative, understanding, redemptive good will for all men. It is an overflowing love that seeks nothing in return. Theologians would say that this is the love of God operating in the human heart. When one rises to love on this level, he loves every man. He rises to the point of loving the person who does the evil deed while hating the deed that the person does. I believe that this is the kind of love that can carry us through this period of transition. This is what we’ve tried to teach through this nonviolent discipline.

    So in many instances, we have been able to stand before the most violent opponents and say in substance, we will meet your capacity to inflict suffering by our capacity to endure suffering. We will meet your physical force with soul force. Do to us what you will and we will still love you. We cannot in all good conscience obey your unjust laws because non-cooperation with evil is just as much moral obligation as is cooperation with good, and so throw us in jail and we will still love you. Threaten our children and bomb our homes and our churches and as difficult as it is, we will still love you. Send your hooded perpetrators of violence into our communities at the midnight hours and drag us out on some wayside road and beat us and leave us half-dead, and as difficult as that is, we will still love you. But be assured that we will wear you down by our capacity to suffer and one day we will win our freedom. We will not only win freedom for ourselves, we will so appeal to your heart and your conscience that we will win you in the process – and our victory will be a double victory.”

  46. Daniel H. Conway permalink
    November 5, 2008 10:05 pm

    Mr. Forrest,

    This is a proper toned sentiment. I thank you for your model. So often the idealization of “the vote” is made so that, for instance one is “voting for life” instead of voting for a Republican. It makes it somehow more…ideal. And exempts the voter from the awful things that the candidate may also stand for.

    Its quite another thing to have said “I’m voting for McCain” than to say “I’m voting ‘pro-life.'” Voting for McCain was so much more pedestrian, perhaps dirty even.

    My suggestion to the folks who were voting for life in Blogland: you should have just just “manned up” and say you’re voting for the McCain, voting for a continued Republican presence in the White House.

    Thanks again for the post.

  47. Tim F. permalink
    November 5, 2008 10:38 pm

    “Amazing. The election is over and the racist comments continue.”

    What’s amazing is that I read this shortly after I had a conversation with my 12 year old daughter about the election. She first asked me if I was mad that Obama won the election. I told her no, I wasn’t mad, just sad and discouraged. I told her it was a good thing that the US had elected a black man as president. The tragedy was the actual man they elected not his skin color. She then told me that her friend was asked by a black girl at school whom she supported for president. Her friend said McCain. The girl asking promptly called her a racist. What really broke my heart was what my daughter said next. She said “I think this election is making me racist”. I told my daughter she was not racist, and had every right to be upset that people throw that term around so easily. I told her that unless she thought people were inferior because of the color of their skin and should be discriminated against and have their rights, civil and or human taken away because of their skin or ethnicity, she was not racist. And then thinking of people like Michael Iafrate and the poison they spread, I informed her that there were people that would call her and me racist simply for being white in America and not subscribing to a certain political agenda. They spread lies that only whites could be racist and blacks and other minorities could not be racist. I told her these were ideologies and theories used as weapons to intimidate people and gain power and advantage. I felt it was a good teaching moment and opportunity to innoculate her against the kind of bs political agiprop she might encounter in college down the road. Of course I didn’t use the term bs in front of her. But yes, I imagine there will be plenty of comments filtered through the prism of race to come. Sad. Very sad.

  48. Franklin Jennings permalink
    November 5, 2008 10:54 pm

    Daniel Conway,

    I voted pro-life. I did not vote for John McCain. So saying I voted for McCain would not be honest.

    But your post certainly demonstrates your fealty to the Democratic party. I’ll grant Vox Novans that; they never claimed to be voting pro-life, they manned up and said they were voting for one of the two parties of death.

  49. Kurt permalink
    November 6, 2008 2:01 pm

    “Organize people to volunteer at the pregnancy centers?”

    It would seem these centers are all run by liberals. Their clientele — women actually considering abortion and much more directly connected to the act of abortion, never get refered to in the wonderfully descriptive terms that get applied to simple Obama voters — murderers, blood-thirsty, vampiric, infant-slaughtering, etc.

    It would be interesting if conservatives would set up some pregnancy centers so these women could be told what they really are.

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